Before slamming celebrities for using loopholes in the access law (which the RA campaigned for) which it wants the Scottish Parliament to close, the Ramblers' Association should remember that under its own governing instruments its AGM (General Council) is always a private function, for around only 150 delegates, who should be elected at the 50 + area AGMs. How many were elected at area AGMs this year? If the RA allowed all interested members to attend and participate, subject to more flexible attendance rules, the AGM and the trustee Board would probably be a great more vibrant and effective. Pressure groups which demand a level playing field across the entire nation must be more open to internal debate.

Yeah, that's exactly the same sort of thing [smiley=evil] Banning the public from a National Park cos a couple of people want to get hitched. What about all the people who wanted to go out and enjoy themselves in the publicly-funded National Park? Or is that similar to an organisation who is open to all to join? Who is self-funded and can, in a similar vein to many political parties, clubs and societies, decide how it manages itself. Sounds like Scotland is bending over itself to be open for business. Too bad if you are a taxpaying citizen who just wants to get out and about. I wonder if the Scots also paid for the police, or did the "celeb" pay for security? Ah well, I wonder what the going rate is for 800 acres of a National Park for 5 days? I hope the public were properly reimbursed by the "celeb", or is it another job for MacVaseline?

Very good points and well put. However, Ramblers Scotland needs many many more members to wield political clout with celebrity exclusion zones, temporary or permanent. I believe that RA Scotland, probably because it is at present small in number, has a more open attendance policy for its annual meeting, unlike RA England and Wales, which is governed by the Charity Commission for E&W. Yes, a club or political pressure group like RA can decide how it governs itself, but that doesn't mean it won't make mistakes. My point is that the RA must set an example, by being more open and accountable to its members. Who are the trustees, what are their interests, why is the AGM of an access campaigning group a private meeting? RA Scotland can set an example to the English RA in this respect. Its Directors applied last year for separate charity status, to the Office of the Scottish Charity Regulator. Registration usually takes a few months. The OSCR still has not confirmed RA Scotland's application. Why the hold up? Campaigning charities can easily cross the line when dealing with political issues and political parties. The Kinfauns case may have ruffled a few too many feathers, and ruffling feathers is what the RA is all about after all. I hope that RA Scotland hasn't bitten off more than it can chew, as the other cases it is pursuing against greedy landowners are equally risky. At present, and until RA Scotland becomes a separate charity, the national RA's trustees are responsible for the legal actions in Scotland. I am not entirely sure whether the English and Welsh ramblers members are able or willing to pay the hundreds of thousands of pounds that might be needed to pursue the Scottish cases all the way. RA often boasts that it is punching above its weight, and a few individuals like its first Secretary Tom Stephenson achieved much in the early days through close political affiliation in Parliament. The RA's leaders have continued this tradition of close political affiliation, which was necessary to achieve the CRoW Act 2000. But the Scottish court cases could bankrupt the RA if it can't recruit more members or draw in massive donations. The RA has achieved much with its slender resources, but greedy landowners will always be inclined to incrementally grab back the rights which the RA has won. We cannot rely on the Labour Party any longer, it has caved in to pressure already regarding the English coast corridor. If the Conservatives take over for a long spell, we could see access and footpaths gradually diminished. They might have good intentions, but being the landowners' party, it is hard to see them doing otherwise. Perhaps campaigning groups only gain a growing membership when their purposes are under great threat. The national RA members are rather politically sedentary these days, it is 500 leisure clubs at local level, and many activists are finding it difficult to inspire the young members to take up the traditional fight against the path blockers. We need Grough to keep an eye on celebrities, inspire the indignant backlash which is needed at local level. RA HQ cannot do it by itself. So, where are the revolting Scottish walking youth? Only with mass energetic trespasses can we defend the rights which were won by the founders.

Golf, a good walk spoiled – even more so now. Shame on the Loch Lomond & The Trossachs National Putting Green for rolling over with their legs in the air.

Good for Grough for providing this open forum for access activists to share ideas. Why doesn't the Ramblers encourage this kind of debate? Is their charitable status a ball and chain? I tried to comment on this and other political subjects on the RA forum, but they censor anything controversial. Most RA members are retired and they just want a quiet life, so official policy is not to upset the old folks. They took Gloag to court and lost a massive amount of charity funds, though we don't know if they presented the case in the best possible way or the judge got it wrong, or if the law was too inflexible. But unless the RA beefs up the debate, motivates its lazy youth not only to get walking but get talking, Grough might be a lone voice in the Scottish wilderness.

Much as we swell at the undeserved compliments regarding our ability to carry debate on all issues regarding the outdoors, we would prefer it if commentators would keep their contributions more germane to the story they refer to, and use one, correct name. We don't want to stifle debate, but let's keep it sensible and -dare I say it - succinct guys and gals, or we may need to take the scissors to the text.